☢️ $OKLO is up over 150% since Badger put it on his radar a month ago. Is it investable?
🤑 Monkey talks about Robinhood Legend, $HOOD’s new trading platform, its dangers and perks
🦉 We address Patreon Steven’s question about how to get the best investing results and how to create a successful framework. Are 30+ stocks too many? What about valuation? And emerging trends?
🦉 A single mom asks us how to start investing. All single moms and all beginning investors should listen to this!
🤖 Stock Safari: Badger talks about Meta $META AI projects while Monkey throws him some rotten bananas and gets all revolutionary!
🛢️ Stock Safari: Monkey pitches Calumet $CLMT a special situation all about making Sustainable Aviation Fuel at high margins
🚨🌴Welcome to the jungle William S, Barry D, Antony E, and Chris A! 🙏 Thank you for supporting Wall Street Wildlife on https://www.patreon.com/wallstreetwildlife! The few bucks you won’t miss will help us make the show and your investing returns better, plus all patreon questions get boosted to the top of the queue!
Sources mentioned:
Calumet Department of Energy 1.4 Billion loan: https://www.energy.gov/lpo/articles/lpo-announces-conditional-commitment-montana-renewables-significantly-expand-us
Segments:
[00:00:00] Introduction
[00:01:36] Is OKLO Actually Uninvestable?
[00:07:31] Robinhood Legend
[00:14:42] How Do You Find The Best Investment Ideas?
[00:21:13] How Do I Get Started Investing?
[00:32:44] Send Us Your Questions!
[00:33:19] Stock Safari – META
[00:44:38] Safari Stock – Calumet $CLMT
—
EP 50
[00:00:00] Introduction
[00:00:02] Luke: Hey and welcome to Wall Street Wildlife. On today’s episode we discuss finding the best investment ideas from the thousands of opportunities that are out there. Should you invest for your kid’s college fund? It’s a bit of a nuanced answer. And we go on stock safari with a manufacturer of sustainable aviation fuel and a metaverse giant.
[00:00:24] Krzysztof: Meanwhile, over in the, uh, Wall Street Wildlife Jungle, we have some new patrons, which we’d like to give a shout out to. William S., Barry D., Anthony E., and Chris A. We have, uh, dolphins, and capybaras, and, sloths, and tigers, and the jungle is getting all beastly. So thank you all for your support. It’s really making a difference.
To us, check us out at patreon.com/wallstreetwildlife.
[00:00:56] Luke: Yeah, thanks guys. And Krzysztof, you were right, right? I know I held you back on Patreon, but The rolling stone is gathering moss. Clearly, there are some guys and girls out there who like the cut of our jib.
[00:01:08] Krzysztof: Yeah, indeed. And they want us to make the show better. That’s why they’re supporting us. So the more of those, dollars trickle in, the better the show is going to get. So thank you so much to, to all y’all you’re making a big difference and including, no small thing, the way we interact with people is getting.
frothier and more substantial and you know, the back and forths are getting deeper and patreon makes a huge difference for that. So, Your questions as patrons go shoot right to the top
[00:01:36] Is OKLO Actually Uninvestable?
[00:01:36] Luke: you know, I got a bit of a Saki comment on X in the last week about one of our stock Safari companies that I highlighted maybe two weeks ago, Oklo, the, uh, small modular reactor manufacturer that’s doing Like chaired by Sam Altman, the OpenAI dude. Uh, someone on my ex said, uh, hey, great calls when I called Oklo uninvestable right now.
Cause it’s current maturity level. And then the stock has doubled since we talked about it.
[00:02:04] Krzysztof: So Doug yeah double that that’s over a hundred percent gain
[00:02:10] Luke: Yeah.
[00:02:11] Krzysztof: Uh, since you called it uninvestable. Oh,
[00:02:15] Luke: going to take the win and the loss on this one because like I called it and flagged it as a very interesting, definitely like a good radar stock, but I still think it’s. Not investable right now. Sure. There’s some momentum around the company. Well, let’s see, let’s go a little bit deeper on why the stock has think it has just about doubled and it’s because there’s just been a bunch of news in this space, two headlines that caught my eyes.
so Microsoft have just made a 20 year agreement to purchase power from constellation energy from one of their. nuclear reactors. And then also, Google have just announced last week. The first corporate agreement to purchase small modular reactor nuclear energy, from Kairos power. And so like, this is the thesis I laid out a couple of weeks ago.
And it’s actually the thesis I laid out a year ago when I was invested in Kairos. In new scale power to get SMR. like these stocks are getting a short term bump because it’s in the news and everyone’s like, Oh, hell, like this makes sense. Like we need power to run AI data centers, but these companies are still best part of a decade away from actually being commercially.
Scaled or even at least, let’s say minimum 2030s before either of these companies are actually generating any material revenue by selling power as opposed to doing like consultancy and other random stuff. So yeah, like I can’t remember the name of the dude who called me out. Great call. But, and he’s right, short term boom, which I missed out on by not investing, keeping it on the radar.
Like these stocks are just going to be volatile as hell. If you got the stomach for it and you take a small position, like good luck to you. But I’ve put it on my stock to do list as SMR and Oklo do not invest before 2026 is exclamation exclamation. That’s what I put in my, uh, investment tracker, like be careful.
[00:04:19] Krzysztof: that’s so interesting. You know, talking about strategy wise, I actually flip back and forth, uh, about how okay I am with my active watch list approach, you know what I mean by that? Uh, I’ve talked about,
[00:04:32] Luke: buying one chair,
[00:04:34] Krzysztof: yeah. And it kind of gets messy and I think I got, I need to improve it. I’d like to have maybe like a separate portfolio on a different, you know, brokerage.
cause you know, I like things looking clean, you know, the companies I’m truly invested in. And then you start adding one share of these interesting ones and then get slot, you know, weeds grow pretty quickly. But I do love, uh, the idea of taking seriously an active watch stock. That’s why I like buying one share when it’s something like, what is, what is Oclo, uh, share price?
[00:05:07] Luke: It’s a 20 share, but it’s now a two and a half billion dollar market cap company. Like this is a company that has no revenue or will have no revenue for at least five, six years earliest.
[00:05:19] Krzysztof: So
[00:05:20] Luke: that’s an expensive valuation.
[00:05:21] Krzysztof: the thing is, I think as investors in 2024, we have information overload, I mean, there’s just so many things to look at and read and find out about. And I know I’ve missed many amazing opportunities before, even when, for example, I hear a good pitch from you about this company. And then it just, if I don’t take it seriously.
It’ll get forgotten. I’ll forget it to, to use English. And so that’s why the buying of one share makes it more real than the otherwise would. And then even if I don’t think it’s investable yet, as per your suggestion, by nature of it being real money, I will check on it way more often than not. And then I get the track, you know, I bought it at this point, I could see what’s happened.
So to me, that strategy makes a difference. It’s imperfect, but
[00:06:11] Luke: Whatever works. Like I’m happy just to have a watch list. Plus it costs me money to trade. Like I would, it would cost me like 20 bucks to buy one 20 share of Oklo, right? So that doesn’t make any sense at all. But,
[00:06:23] Krzysztof: wait, what are you talking about? You’re paying your, you still have a brokerage that charges per trade.
[00:06:28] Luke: uh, yeah, it’s pretty common in the UK. The only one I’m using that doesn’t is, well, it’s a rabbit hole, right? So, like, I’m using trading 212 for my king of the jungle portfolio, which is kind of like Robin Hood, but those guys have you, like, even though you’re not, they’re offering fractional trading and like zero commission trading, like they’re getting you at the other end on like wider spreads or maybe a crappier FX rate, or maybe they’re Like payment for order flow, you know, you are the product, not the customer.
So like, it’s fine for small amounts of money, but if you’re investing larger amounts of money, like I wouldn’t be using those kinds of platforms.
[00:07:07] Krzysztof: sure. It makes sense. My takeaway from, your research on Oklo. And the fact that this area is still really early and it’s not fully investable is I am actually going to buy one share in my portfolio because there’s obviously interesting things happening.
in this sector. That’s my takeaway.
[00:07:28] Luke: Yeah, fair enough, fair enough. It’s on my watch list too. Yeah.
[00:07:31] Robinhood Legend
[00:07:31] Krzysztof: I found the latest Robinhood presentation quite interesting. I’d like to talk about Robinhood as a product. So much less about the stock and it being investable or not. I haven’t done a good enough deep dive, so no, no idea. Although it’s, it’s been doing pretty well, but Robinhood is the platform that I use.
And for better or worse, it makes. Investing, uh, really easy and appealing because it’s, user interface is, is I think the best that I’ve come across. The downside of that is that it is extraordinarily easy to treat it like a casino because you’re literally carrying a casino in your pocket and to buy or sell a share could be a matter of an impulse, right? So for people that have issues with impulsivity or self control, Robinhood is And many people have blown up their accounts in just this way.
So do not, if you have a gambling problem, double, you know, Robinhood is not for you. But if you have some checks and balances in place, I love the platform. So they have an announcement that they’re going to add more products like futures and all kinds of fancy. Professional level trading vehicles. I didn’t really care about that so much, but what I did really look forward to is that they are going to add a trading platform.
That’s way more robust into the app itself. To me, this matters because as you know, I spent about a year learning the technical side of trading, you know, the, what you call drawing with crayons and crystal balls and all of that. And I came away with that quite with an ambivalent feeling, right? There’s a lot that is gambling ish related and nobody knows.
And you could draw, use your crayons all day long. And also, simultaneously, if you zoom way out, price is a very clear indicator of what’s happening. It’s like a clean data point and you can learn how to use it to your benefit of timing entry and exit points, uh, if that’s not the only thing you do. I love, uh, currently I use a platform called TradingView, which allows me a more sophisticated look at price points and data points.
Robinhood is essentially saying we are going to create our own trading platform so that you could have advanced technicals on top of your ability to buy and sell all in one platform. So to me, this is like a huge win win as long as, again, I don’t violate my My basic principles. Here’s why I think this will be a boom for the stock itself for the company.
Potentially I pay money to trading view for their trading platform. It’s how I keep track of my watch lists. And I mean, it’s one of the tools. I use. So I see the charts, I see my stock list, and I bounce between them, right? ain’t cheap. Because the more, you know, you get into this world, the more indicators you want to use, and you know, they upsell you.
To, if you want more toys, you pay us more money. Robinhood just came out and said this, their product, the Robinhood Legend, will be free. So, all of a sudden, I’m thinking, you know, I like their user interface, their shadier days at the beginning were, you know, they have a bad history, but I think they’ve done a lot to overcome that.
And with the user interface and the trading platform and the ease of setting up something like a Roth IRA and they have crypto, although I wouldn’t caveat there because you don’t really own the crypto you buy on it, it’s seeming to me like it’s emerging as a one stop. Shop for everything and since user interface is their strength and you know the charts and graphs and stuff is all user interface ish, I imagine the product’s going to be very robust from the start.
Um, so if you learn to use it properly, I think, like especially like things like buy and sell uh, limit orders, I imagine it’s going to be a great integration and good for the stock overall. So I’m really excited.
[00:11:51] Luke: Hey, so, uh, here’s an invitation, right? So I know I am a massive technical trading skeptic. I’ve at least now over the last, this is actually episode 50. So the last 50 episodes of this podcast and the previous podcast, we used to do no limit. I’ve kind of gotten used to your mumbo jumbo. And at least I don’t.
Like, call you out on it too hard. So when you get Robin Hood Legends, how about we do a technical trading episode and you just gimme like a live demo and show me all the weird and wonderful things you do and how it works and what you look for. And, and I’ll, I’ll try and be non skeptical if
[00:12:29] Krzysztof: You’re already smirk, you’re already,
[00:12:31] Luke: I know
[00:12:32] Krzysztof: can’t even, you can’t even hold back for, for, for a second. Yeah, no, I’d be glad to, I’d be glad to, you know, here’s the thing, you know, you and I see, see the investing world in pretty much similar terms. It’s like, it’s the little nuances around the edges that make, make us an interesting duo.
And to your great credit, there’s, I do think a lot of. I would say like crypto, there’s so much mumbo jumbo that poses as the real thing, that odds are high when somebody crosses paths with this stuff, they are looking at a bunch of bullshit, but it’s the, it’s the actual use cases, the legitimate ones, if you can find your way to them.
That can make a big difference. Like, for example, to use that analogy, Bitcoin, right, is legit. Casino meme coins are not legit. Certain ways of using charts are a powerful tool. So I just like,
[00:13:30] Luke: know, you know, I have you in, I’ve got like, as I ca classify all my friends, um, I’ve got a couple of friends and you’re now in this box with. two, two good friends, Christine and Nikki, both of whom are incredibly intelligent, high functioning people, but also believe in magic.
So you’re in that group.
[00:13:54] Krzysztof: uh, we shall see. We shall see. Okay. Uh, so anyway, that, that’s a, that’s just a kind of unofficial way of saying put Robinhood, the stock on, if you’re listening to this, put it on your watch list. The ticker is H O O D. And the company is starting to gain, legitimacy in my eyes.
[00:14:18] Luke: Yeah. Fair enough. Fair enough. I mean, there’s certainly got, like a well known brand and then with a certain type of maybe younger investor. Like they do seem to be the platform of choice, so
[00:14:29] Krzysztof: Yeah. And it makes, uh, it makes a big difference. I’ll also touch on Robinhood a little later in the episode when we answer one of our listener questions, because the principle behind it, I think is, is really important. So anyway, onwards.
[00:14:42] How Do You Find The Best Investment Ideas?
[00:14:42] Luke: for our, discussion topic for today before we get to our Safari stocks, we do have a couple of questions from Stephen and Hannah. I think you wanted to chat a little bit about. Stephen’s question is a long rambling question. I think I fielded most of it on Twitter already, but, part of that you wanted to pick on Krzysztof, which was how do you find the best investment ideas from the thousands of opportunities out there?
[00:15:09] Krzysztof: Yeah. So Steve, I wanted to say that when you have something like 30 plus stocks, as I think you mentioned in your question, that to me feels like Uh, and I’m not, I’m saying when I hear 30, I’m saying real investment ideas with 60. Substantial cash whether that’s two percent or ten percent, you know If you have more than one share assuming, you know share is cheap Then 30 is just gets to me too noisy because I can’t keep up I just can’t keep up with that many companies to have legitimate confidence.
So I like having a more concentrated portfolio
[00:15:44] Luke: let’s just say why that is, because that’s, that is important, but we do say it often, like if you are going to be investing in individual companies. You’ve got to do your due diligence and at the very minimum, let’s say, and this isn’t enough, you’ve got to look at the annual report and just do a proper sort of check in.
And it might just be doing a page turn on like a 30 or 40 page PowerPoint deck from the company once a year to make sure you understand their mission and they’re kind of where they are in the market. But ideally you’re doing more than that. Like every quarter you’re reading that. And if you really want to get arms Dirty.
Then you are also reading like the 10 Q and the 10 K, and you’re looking at a lot of financial data too, and hopefully you’re listening to the earnings calls, so you know, wherever you are on that spectrum, you can’t just buy it and forget it if it’s a material part of your portfolio.
[00:16:32] Krzysztof: that’s right listen to earnings calls To me is the most bonafide way of doing what you’re saying. But think about it. Think about the commitment. If you have 30 companies, that’s 30 calls you have to listen to. That’s like a full time job. That’s one a day for a month. Right? I mean, it’s so, so there, we can nuance this a little bit, right?
Because for example, if you’ve been a longtime investor in Amazon and you know, it’s one of these behemoth companies, then maybe you don’t have to listen to each call, right? So you could have like five of those companies that are sort of like anchors. They’re going to be fine. You don’t have to worry about them, but in general, To me, uh, approaching 20 is kind of like the, the pushing it, right?
So anyway, that’s step one. The main thing I wanted to say is that true to my name as an investing monkey, I’ve tried different styles and different approaches to investing and where I’m at now, this current moment in time. Finds me, one, both as long time listeners know, worried about the general macro conditions, and thinking that the market is highly, valued or very expensive.
So that means, I am now spending more of my time hanging out in the, from our former seven investing days in the dung heap pile. I am looking specifically for companies that are sort of de disentangled from the market in general. In other words, special situations, if you want to call them that, right?
That there’s a big gap between perceived and actual value. So usually smaller companies, usually there’s some weird shit going on. Or so that’s the valuation point. So the point one to tie a ribbon on this valuation matters to me. And I think it matters to all great classic investors, but there are periods in time where valuations get skewed in either direction, overvalued or undervalued.
I’m preferring to look right now in the undervalued sectors. That’s why I’m invested in a company like Coherus. It’s not that I love it, I don’t, I really don’t love it, but, but value is value, and eventually I think I’m going to be right because the research is sound. Two, is trends. Trends are your friends, that’s true for technical analysis, You want to invest in the stock that’s going up, not down.
So it’s a little bit counterintuitive based on what I said before. But in the other places, like, you know, we’re, we talk about this all the time, right? Where’s the world going? And so this is why my stock safari of today is what it is. it’s because I’ve been studying the trends of renewable energy. and batteries and what the government is doing right to help these projects and over time I’ve amassed massive amounts of you know data and information about this stuff so any time I find a company that kind of fits in this broader like parameters.
then I’m interested because I already know a lot about the pieces involved So, once you spot a good trend that you become knowledgeable about, all kinds of opportunities show up. And for you, I would say, Luke, this is what we were talking about, right? The nuclear reactor. segment, Oklo, right? You’ve done your work.
Now those kinds of companies will be easier for you to spot,
[00:19:57] Luke: Yeah, that’s like, it’s fundamental to my own investing process over the last 20 years. Everything I’m invested in, almost without fail, is tied to some kind of mega trend, like something that’s happening or I think is going to happen in society that’s going to make the products or services that the companies I’m invested in selling make them more valuable.
And so it’s going to be like a tailwind for those companies. I think that can be a very powerful factor.
[00:20:24] Krzysztof: right? So maybe to flesh this out a little bit, to, to see how, like how I started on this trend, I became fascinated with Tesla from the start, but then all of a sudden they start making these megapack, you know, power walls and megapack batteries. That got me interested in reading a book called the grid.
Which is this amazing book written by an anthropologist about how the, you know, electric grid works and why batteries are badly needed. You know, I was reading that because all of a sudden I was investigating EOSE. Now I know all about, you know, long duration energy storage and yada yada. And now all of a sudden the Department of Energy is, you know, Handing out all these loans in the sectors just has this massive, massive tailwind and that’s where I’m looking.
And so that’s how I think I’m gonna get my biggest market beating returns
[00:21:13] How Do I Get Started Investing?
[00:21:13] Luke: Hey, so Krzysztof, moving on, we also had a question on YouTube, which is another platform we love to debate and chat stocks with our listeners, uh, from Hannah.
What did Hannah want to know?
[00:21:24] Krzysztof: So Hannah wanted to know when to invest in the stock market versus when to invest in real estate or starting a business or college extra certification. I’m a single mom of a 14 and 11 year old, so time has often been in short commodity as has money. If I find myself in a position with an excess of both, how do I properly allocate them to prepare for kids going off to college in five years or 10?
Start with the basics. Which app do I use? What if I need the money in the future and have to pull it out again for life’s emergencies? Is that a different strategy? And which investments can and should I pull from? So on and so forth. There’s a lot of questions that Hannah asked you know, if, if you take the perspective of somebody that is not familiar with the investing world, here’s my takeaway.
There’s so much that is overwhelming. In the way this question reads to me, it’s one question after another after another, and all of a sudden, I think people can get overwhelmed and confused, and for good reason. Hannah, I want to answer your question by not answering any of them, and saying this instead. with, start in the way that Luke and I have been modeling here on Wall Street Wildlife in the King of the Jungle portfolio. that we said a year ago was we’re going to start with a thousand dollars each because that is meant to signify amount of money that is not a lot. You could chop off a zero, you could add a zero, it doesn’t matter.
But some amount that is something to you, not nothing, but says I am now in the game. And then, once a month, Luke and I add, automatically, My account on SoFi is set to automatic deposits. I don’t even need to think about it. Automatically, we’re adding a hundred dollars per month. is all you need to do to get started, honestly, and that’s the hardest bit.
Forget all the other stuff for now. Luke’s going to touch on some, some additional issues, right? But for me, the main point is find an app. And in this case, this is where it ties in. I would recommend Robinhood because in fact, they’ll allow you to open up an IRA right from the start, which is that allows you to. Deposit up to 7, 000 a year. That’s basically really good for your taxes So start with Robinhood, open up in the IRA, deposit, call it a thousand bucks in there, and then listen to our show every single week. And as you listen to our show, you’ll get all kinds of ideas and strategies, and you’ll develop your knowledge base from there.
But just get started.
[00:24:07] Luke: Yeah, that’s the number one thing. And like, we are going to go a bit deeper on this. And in some ways I might, I might immediately now tell you why it might not be right to invest a lot of money, particularly if you’ve got possibly like, you’re kind of just getting started and you know, like the college bill is going to be like turned on in the next four or five years.
Like typically if you’re investing, it shouldn’t be in money you need in the next five years. And you do want to have things like an emergency fund And like short term savings for your short term savings goals. But even then, like you could still take A couple of thousand bucks, whatever, you know, whatever, an amount of money that you could afford to put aside for more than five years and just get your investing journey started.
That is the number one most important thing. And if you can do it in a tax efficient way, if you’re in the US, as Krzysztof said, like an IRA account, if you’re in the UK, they’re called ISAs. trading 212, the platform I mentioned earlier, kind of like the UK equivalent of Robinhood, they have an ISA product now and lets you buy fractional shares in your ISA.
They’ve actually got ahead of UK regulations a little bit, but the regulations are catching up with them. Like that’s a perfectly fine place to start your investing journey.
[00:25:22] Krzysztof: Yeah, so a little backstory to this question. A part of it was Hannah was asking me whether she should get involved in day trading because she has extra time. And I said no. because that call that graduate level, you know, it’s a supplement, it ought to be a supplement. But if you have extra time, then it’s not about the money, there’s so much that you’re going to learn in your first call it five years.
Before you get confident in ideas and how to think about things that none of it will stick unless you have some actual skin in the game. That’s why my principle is just get started, listen to what Luke’s saying, you don’t, you’re not going to invest all your savings because that needs to be safe and then an emergency fund and so on and so forth.
But whether it’s a hundred bucks, a thousand bucks, 10, 000 bucks. Everything we say on the show and teach and try to live from will make a bigger difference if you’re actually doing it yourself.
[00:26:23] Luke: and if investing becomes like a bit of a passion for you and a hobby. you probably could start investing in individual companies, but if you’re a single mom of two kids and life is just complicated as it is, and maybe you’re holding down like one or more jobs and you just try and juggle so many things, maybe investing in individual companies isn’t the right thing to do.
Like it takes time to try to beat the market and most people who try to beat the market don’t succeed. It’s perfectly acceptable and legit just to buy some passive index trackers. Take your thousand bucks, chuck it in like VOO, V O O, it’s an S& P 500 tracker, maybe buy like a NASDAQ tracker or if you’re in the UK a FTSE tracker, just buy an index.
Make sure the fees are as low as possible, keep contributing money every month, try not to look at it for the next 20 years. And you’ll have like a nice surprise. Like your retirement will be set up if you’ve approached it in the right way. If you are going to invest in individual companies, like I think you’re either treating it as.
Kind of a bit of fun and entertainment and it’s a game and it’s an amount of money that you don’t mind losing or you’re taking it really seriously but that means putting in like a ton of sweat. As Krzysztof said 20 minutes ago, like that’s listening to the earnings calls, that’s doing your due diligence and maybe your life just can’t accommodate that right now.
[00:27:46] Krzysztof: Well, that’s uh, right. So we’re given two separate answers. Uh, Hannah is in a interesting position that She’s saying she has extra time on her hands. So she’s looking for a skill set. So that’s why i’m saying investing itself is a huge skill set. It’s a lifetime’s journey
[00:28:02] Luke: let’s sort of see where, like the, the dichotomy of types of investors, because I think it is dangerously alluring as a newer investor to get sucked into this world, whirlpool of like charts and technical metrics and things like that. Because you want to feel like you’re doing something to sort of try and manage the, what is ultimately just like in the short term, it’s just.
Volatility. It’s like randomness over my, you know, big companies. Okay, sure. Put like the Amazons and the Apples aside, but smaller companies day to day and month to month, they’re just going to flitter around up and down randomly. And you want to feel like you’re not just kind of going into a casino. You want, you’re trying to take control of this and make intelligent decisions.
But I think it can be Dangerously illusory if the decisions are just watching like the patterns of a thing on a chart as opposed to studying the fundamentals of a company. like if you, if you’re coming into this clean and you’re like, Oh, should I take up technical trading? Like, I think that could legitimately be a skillset you add on after you’re doing the, the, the actual important stuff, which is understanding the companies you’re planning to invest in, but don’t do that first.
[00:29:18] Krzysztof: Badger’s suggestion to invest in something like indexes if you don’t have much time is good if the problem or if the problem you’re trying to solve is how do I just make more money? But Hannah is asking a slightly different question, I think for the most part.
Which is, I have more time, I’d like to acquire skillset. I’m saying don’t start with day trading, start and open an actual account so everything feels real to you and then listen to our show because, right, I mean it’s not just self serving, listen to our show, right, but in listening to our show you will come across the fundamental principles that take time to understand and then practice and then integrate and then, you know, the, the way life happens.
It’s like the idea makes sense, but the execution is hard, but you have to get started with something meaningful. It can’t remain theoretical, I think.
[00:30:13] Luke: Yeah, agree. And I, maybe I read too much into like the words Hannah’s used in her question, but I get a sense, maybe this is unfair, that she’s looking for like a quick fix. what do I start doing? how do I start making money? And then when, at what point can I start to draw money out? Like that’s kind of, you’ve set yourself a high bar there.
You set yourself aggressive expectation and really. Like this is, you’re not going to like this, shit it’s boring. But when you’re investing, it’s like a 20 year plus journey. You’re not really going to see results that are going to be at all meaningful on the way you live your life. Certainly in the first 10 years, but probably not.
For the first 20 years, maybe not even longer. This is about a lifelong journey. And if you, you know, if you can’t, uh, if that just seems too long, then there might be other places where you can invest your time, your extra hours, more profitably, just, you know, in some other kind of job as opposed to, or starting your own business or doing something else, as opposed to trying to become an investor to make a quick buck.
Like, you might get lucky, just like the guy who goes to the casino and sticks his life savings on black might get lucky, but you’re just as likely to come up short.
[00:31:31] Krzysztof: Yeah. And maybe to sound a little bit more moderate, I would say if you invest something like a hundred dollars a month, And you follow our principles and you learn and you keep learning, in 10 years you are going to have more money than you thought you could. But yes, so in other words, 10 years, what I’m trying to say is 10 years is not 20, because 20 could seem really over, you know, like really far down the road. 10 years from now, it will make, doing this will make a substantial difference to all beginning investors. And patience and forbearance is a virtue for a reason. This is a crime I’ve committed against myself many times that I got too clever. I got too smart for my own good. I knew too many things. And then I got greedy.
I wanted the quick solution. I want, you know, I made really asymmetric risk, risky bets, and then lo and behold, it blew up in my face. So slow and steady is the way. Um, and you’ll be surprised how quickly 10 years goes by as well. So I hope that, that, that sort of convoluted, uh, answer from multiple angle makes sense.
Let us know on Patreon or YouTube, if it did.
[00:32:44] Send Us Your Questions!
[00:32:44] Luke: great stuff. All right, and we do always welcome listener questions wherever you find us. a quick plug for where the show is. As Krzysztof says, like, if you have the ability to become one of our patreons, we would very much appreciate it. You can find us at patreon. com slash wallstreetwildlife. But we’re also just here on YouTube at wallstreetwildlife.
And we’re on X. You can find me at 7LukeHallard.
[00:33:11] Krzysztof: At seven flying platypus.
[00:33:13] Luke: Like, hit us up with your investing questions and we’ll incorporate them into future shows.
[00:33:19] Stock Safari – META
[00:33:19] Krzysztof: Yes, indeed. Are we ready for stock safari?
[00:33:23] Luke: I’m ready to go on safari with my stock.
[00:33:25] Krzysztof: Yeah, I see it. I’m like, oh, I think I see what’s coming. I see what’s coming here, but I’m ready. And you know what? Actually before you even start, sorry for stealing your thunder, but I think I’m gonna probably be easier to convince because you know, your man now is a serious jujitsu guy.
I’m like, he’s like reformed his image, right? From, from villain to sort of hero. So I’m like, okay, maybe who knows? So go Europe.
[00:33:54] Luke: If you haven’t figured out who Krzysztof is talking about, it is Mark Zuckerberg, who’s now a jiu jitsu dude and like a suit wearing, flag carrying, whatever that thing you do on like a bouncy board in the sea is. Yeah, the guy, like, he’s a bit of a He’s a boss suddenly, but this is my stock for stock Safari.
I know these are typically smaller off the radar companies, but I really wanted to stick this one on cause this is genuinely on my watch list right now is Meta previously known as Facebook ticker M E T A and I’ll talk briefly about why I’m looking at Meta again, but before I get into that, I just want to.
Kind of give a, give a shout out to the ability to change your mind is an investing superpower. Like I owned Facebook personally from, I think something like 2010 to 2019, something like that. And I made good money on it. And you know, my investment thesis then was all about advertising because they have clearly, well, this is, I think it’s probably the pre Instagram days.
It was just Facebook, but they clearly had like, A winning social media network almost reinvented the landscape and the data they had was pretty unique. I thought no one else would have anything like that. And the thesis played out, they did really well, but then I kind of soured on the idea of owning a company like that.
And actually, I’ve said on record on the Telescope Investing Podcast many times, I will never invest in this company. Like social media has killed the world. Well, I’ve, I’ve gone full circle now.
[00:35:31] Krzysztof: That’s because you’re a tech addict. That’s because
[00:35:33] Luke: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I am.
Well,
[00:35:35] Krzysztof: just need more social media in your veins.
[00:35:39] Luke: I hate Facebook. I hate Instagram. I hate bloody Threads. I’m on those platforms because, you know, we’re trying to build an audience. So why not be on them? I just find them awful to use. I mean, I hate LinkedIn even more, and I’m on that too. Like the only platform I actually enjoy using is X and now YouTube.
Actually, YouTube seems there are some smart people on YouTube and smart comments. But anyway, despite why I hate all of Zuckerberg’s platforms, but use them anyway, like why is this company on my stock Safari watch list? Uh, for a couple of reasons. So they have more than a 21 percent share. of the whole global market for digital advertising.
And their main competitors are Google and actually Amazon, big competitor. so massive market share and digital advertising. That’s where all the money is flowing. So they’re always going to get like a nice chunk of that with all of their range of platforms. And let’s not forget one of their platforms, which could be a sleeping giant is WhatsApp.
What’s that Seems to be the only messaging platform that seems to be like ubiquitous across both Android and iOS. Apple uses and seems to be in most countries, and indeed in some countries, it’s like the main way of communicating.
I know I had to like pull my US friends teeth out to get them onto Whatsapp and using it a bit more consistently, but it seems it’s being adopted in the US even more consistently. And like Meta, They’re not really monetizing it yet. It’s quite early in the monetization journey for WhatsApp and WhatsApp for business.
There’s some really powerful tools. If you’re like a small company or even a massive company, and you want to use WhatsApp to build some automations and communicate with your customers. Like it plugs in really nicely into your backend systems and lets you manage like thousands of customer conversations and that might either be cross selling and upselling or it might be providing support, whatever it might be.
So I think there’s, there’s a lot of monetization still to be had from WhatsApp. The reason I’m really, I’ve got Meta on my radar is all the fun AI stuff and some interesting things they’re doing with hardware. So this is actually now like the hot place to be if you’re an AI researcher. Meta’s spending something like 40 billion dollars a year on R& D and I think they’ve recently released LLAMA 3.
2 but like the LLAMA 3 is like, because it’s open source and it’s also one of the most powerful. AI stacks, but because it’s open source, it’s being much more rapidly adopted by developers. and like Meta are using their technology for themselves as well, because Llama 3 sits behind a lot of the AI for like generating your Instagram feed.
And let’s not forget, right, the convergence of large language models of which LLAMA3 is one. And masses of proprietary data, that’s where the value sits, where these two things converge. And Meta have got them both. Now they’ve got one of the world’s best models, and they’ve got this huge repository of proprietary data that no one else has across all of their social media platforms.
And then that’s just the last reason it’s on my watch list, and I love this product, and I think this is the way to go. Not the headsets that, uh, that Apple are chasing with the Vision Pro. It’s Meta’s Orion AR glasses. I’ll pop a picture up on screen now if you’re on YouTube. Like, you look like a bit of a dork if you’re wearing one of these things.
You’re clearly a fairly rich dork because there’s only a couple of thousand models been produced. It’s very much a pilot project, and each of those costs 10, 000 each. Like, this is not cheap. It’s not consumer hardware, but I think this is the journey to truly Adopting augmented reality into like our day to day working and there’s a whole bunch of stuff that Meta have done from a hardware perspective that really shows I think they’re leading the way, not just in the vision of the like the form factor because it’s so simple, it’s like a little wristband and it’s a pair of glasses and there’s like a little like uh thing talking to your phone there’s not much like it’s making the hardware invisible but also their own Project Aria.
is developing their own custom silicon working with TSMC, Taiwan Semi, because you need custom silicon to get like super low power and just like reduce the form factor so you can get it into like the frames of what looks like a chunky but regular pair of glasses. Like this is the way AR is going to go and I do feel like Zook is leading the path here.
[00:40:31] Krzysztof: Can I be a real, can I throw some rotten bananas at you?
[00:40:34] Luke: Do please, yeah, absolutely.
[00:40:37] Krzysztof: Um, I’ve been off Facebook for for some time, even though I muck around on Instagram for the same reasons you do, same company, but in my head, I conveniently said, let’s not, you know, I sort of split them into two. But if you remember some shows back, I went on this little mini rant with a promise for more about techno feudalism. I mean, I’ve been doing a lot of, uh, in my spare time, a lot of deep diving into, political structures and economic structures and, you know, a lot of the philosophy behind 20th century and how human beings are still trying to find, you know, the best way of organizing ourselves. In some of the refrains, I’m hearing more and more from a lot of these thinkers is that capitalism is now dead, or has sort of transformed very far from the its optimal form, which is free market competition, to a moment in time where you have a couple of these giant behemoths, that now control everything so you no longer really have a choice like you’re not going to use anything besides google and if you’re on social media really not going to do anything besides what facebook offers so when you said proprietary data really what that means is all the ways these companies are spying on us or surreptitiously stealing our preferences and our data points in order to make us Target us, literally target us.
more directly to buy all kinds of shit that we don’t really need. And so from that angle If you invest in something like Meta, I would encourage our listeners to poke around a little bit about how, you know, how these companies really make their money.
And the short answer is they’re making it off you. You are the serf working their land for their profit and you are getting nothing for it. So there’s a really dark, shady side to all this.
[00:42:40] Luke: Yeah, I don’t disagree. And, uh, I was particularly put off with, like, the Cambridge Analytica scandal, like, way back, which influenced, like, actually not just the US election, but multiple, political movements in different countries around the same time. And it was, Like a British firm of evildoers misusing information and the algorithm on Facebook to influence political opinions and to kind of do dark things, like, that way leads to a very bad place.
[00:43:13] Krzysztof: You know, the tricky thing here is that’s the thing. Uh, I, I promise I won’t go too deep. too long. I won’t go on and on. I’ll say, historically, we know when there’s these like pressure moments, like, like crossroads, you either give in to the current system, or there’s revolution. But capitalism is tricky with this form of capital, like for you to opt out, you really have to opt out.
But how many people are going to be willing to opt out of Facebook and Instagram and all of these things are sucking away your freedom and data and your, you know, all of that. The answer, I think, truthful answer is not many, but if you do want to take that path, there is an alternative. It’s just at this moment in time, it would require a whole lot of you to sort of really get off the grid because otherwise, You know, you’re being milked for every penny.
And if freedom is a thing, you know, you either at least keep, you have your eyes open. That’s, I guess all I’m saying, you know, prepare to be a revolutionary or say they got me, you know, I’m their slave and then be a very happy, willing slave. Whistle while you work.
[00:44:23] Luke: At least if you are a shareholder in some of these companies, then, uh, you, you’re enriching yourself as well with
[00:44:29] Krzysztof: There you go. That’s the right, that’s the loophole.
[00:44:34] Luke: far less controversial. Why don’t you tell us about your safari stock for this week?
[00:44:38] Safari Stock – Calumet $CLMT
[00:44:38] Krzysztof: boy, I never expected to talk about a company like this, but based on the earlier question from, from Steve, this is what I was alluding to because of my knowledge, because my long journey now with EOSE, I’m sort of really, uh, sensitive and fine tuned to the workings of the Department of Energy and all the loans that they’re, uh, The government is basically pushing massive, massive amounts of money onto all kinds of companies that are working in the renewable energy sector.
So, step one in my pitch for Calumet, I think that’s how you say it, C A L U M E T. M E T, stock ticker C L M T. This is another one of these special situations that, uh, heads up is really, really effing complicated. So I’m not going to go into the backwater financial stuff. Cause it’s, it’s over my head. It’s over many investors heads, but the big picture, uh, holistically, there’s a lot to like.
So, I know that EOSLone from the Department of Energy is going to close within months, but that has taken like, they got the conditional approval last August. So it’s been what, like 15 months now? it’s taken a full year and change. for the current administration to have gone on the record saying they’re creating a thousand jobs by funding a battery plant in Pittsburgh, which is EOS, blah, blah, blah, right?
So EOS is about to get a whole lot of money to expand their operations. Well, there’s this other company, it’s, it’s going through the same, almost the same playbook. it’s a business that has two, two sections. The first is specialty products. Basically, they convert specialty chemicals like solvents, waxes, and lubricants, okay?
Like, think about when you polish your car, that product, right, to make the wheels shiny, you get at one of those auto stores, right? This is Calumet’s boring, steady, ain’t going nowhere business. All right, that’s its sort of state safety drop. You’d be investing in, in those kinds of products. That’s not what I care about. Calumet also has a subsidiary called Montana Renewables, and this is where all the magic is happening. This is a highly leveraged company at the moment. So when you look at the balance sheet, it looks awful. Little cash, massive amount of debt, but they are also a first mover.
And basically they have a, call it a major plant that takes the necessary ingredients, hydrocarbons, to turn them into RD, Renewable Diesel, and SAF, Sustainable Aviation Fuel. All right, and they’re located geographically in a prime location of the country, which makes the margins and the influx of the needed materials easy to access.
So all of a sudden, the governments around the world, including the U. S., are saying we need to make fuels for planes more, green. Montana Renewables is the place that’s going to lead the charge. Okay, so that’s the setup for this. But how, when you have a company that’s massive, massively levered? Well, lo and behold, the, the whole point of this thesis is relies on what happened last week.
The United States government gave Calumet a conditional 1. 4 billion loan. Unlike it’s scheduled to close within 30 to 60 days because unlike EOS, it doesn’t have a long checklist of stuff that needs to happen. This is mostly like paperwork. So let’s assume it gets the money end of November. Call it December.
They’re going to take that money. They’re going to de lever a whole bunch of, uh, their financial shenanigans. And then with the extra, they’re going to expand their capacity for the sustainable aviation fuel, which has way higher margins than normal fuel. So basically this is one of these special situations that the market is not savvy to.
Because when they look at the balance sheet, it’s horrific and they have doubt and skepticism about the Department of Energy and how long and how long it takes, but it’s different because all of the specifics are quite different. If things go according to plan, the way I’m sort of describing them, you’re looking at a stock that is valued mostly according to those specialty products.
Right. The boring stuff and the market’s like, yeah, that’s what we know how to value, but they are not taking into account what happens when this Montana renewables, factory all of a sudden expands really, really quickly because they now have the money to do it. And the margins start rising because of all the government mandates and so on and so forth.
So it’s, it has a tremendous. uh, revaluing inflection point happening now that the DOE loan is basically in hand.
[00:49:54] Luke: candidate for stock safari. And as a reminder to our listeners, we don’t necessarily think these are great investments. They’re mostly things that are on our radar in this segment. , and if there’s a stock that you’re interested in and you think we should consider for stock safari, like hit us up on the social medias and let us know.
[00:50:12] Krzysztof: Right, because uh, yeah, I guess I want to say so far we’ve done what, uh, Sphere, we, Oklo, and Nintendo, and now today’s stocks, right? If we hear from you that some of these pitches are really intriguing to you, then I think, uh, Luke and I will be happy to do more sophisticated, more fleshed out official deep dive into any of these, but we’re making this an audience participation kind of thing where you tell us where you want us to dig.
[00:50:43] Luke: Yeah, like it’s a ton of work to do a deep dive on a company. Like it takes me a week really to go like all the way down and really understand. So I’m certainly not committing to doing that. But, uh, like if it intrigues me enough, I will, because then it’s potentially a candidate for investment.
[00:50:59] Krzysztof: Yep. So take a listen to our back episodes and find a company that piques your ears. And we’re already interested could be because we did some initial reconnaissance and then let’s see where the road takes us. For what it’s worth in full transparency, I did actually buy some shares of Calumet, uh, after the closing, after the loan announcement, last week.
[00:51:22] Luke: Cool. Very good. Yeah. I wasn’t going to mention it on the pod, but I’ve borrowed your due diligence and I know you’re, uh, you talked about it earlier in this episode, Coherus Biosciences. So I took out like an option position a few months ago, like the stock is now like a sub hundred million dollar company with what seemed to be, I’m borrowing your DD, what seems to be decent quality earnings.
So yeah, I’ve got an order in to add to my options position. I’m gonna see if that
[00:51:51] Krzysztof: Let me say, let me, let me, uh, not warn you against that, but this is, because I was in a similar position with EOSE, uh, when it fell down to whatever it was, 70 cents, and now it’s 300 percent higher. At some point, I think the shares are so deeply undervalued. That it makes more sense to buy the shares rather than the options because remember options are a way to gain more leverage But they come at a cost with time and Coherus right now Even though you could buy the January 26 is the market could sometimes take longer than you think to properly Rerate so if you’re getting the stock that’s in theory worth 7 a share for 80 cents You’re Then the leverage is already so massive.
Why not just buy the shares outright and not worry about having it come to fruition by January of 2026. That would be my recommendation to.
[00:52:50] Luke: Because, uh, because I’ve not done my own due diligence, and I hate the idea of buying something in my real portfolio that I haven’t done the work on, but my options, still it’s not like small beans, it’s like, you know, it’s a chunk of cash, but that’s my gambling money, that’s my gambling messing around money, so that’s where it lives currently.
[00:53:11] Krzysztof: Okay, well, you heard it here, folks. I’m advocating for shares outright.
[00:53:15] Luke: Yeah, that’s almost certainly the wiser course, but screw it, I’m at the casino. Alrighty, I think that’s the top of our episode for this week. This was episode 50. Look at that. Like we’re nearly two episodes time will be a year in. Oh, and actually two episodes time will be a year in and it will be officially be the end of the King of the Jungle Portfolio Challenge.
[00:53:36] Krzysztof: Yes, and it’s not looking good. It’s looking so bad for Monkey right now. Unless we get the, unless we get the DOE close for EOSE and it goes up like 3.
[00:53:48] Luke: I do want to say also, I’m going to be popping out to Vietnam in the next couple of weeks and I’m spending time with none other than my good buddy Albert from the, Telescope Investing Days. So I’m hoping to stick a bit of bonus content on the podcast. If you’re a fan of the old Telescope Investing Show, well, uh, I’ll try and get Albert doing laps in the pool while I lament him over his terrible investments.
[00:54:12] Krzysztof: Awesome. So jealous. I love, uh, I’ve taught a course at the university called the Rhetoric of the Vietnam War. So that’s a particular thing I’ve had deep interest in. I want to see you record this episode. I’m one of those little, uh, bikes and like scooters, live action, badger weaving, weaving through the streets of Vietnam and the marketplace would love that.
So would all the listeners.
[00:54:38] Luke: is even going to fit in the episode, but tiny anecdote, like last time, Katrina and I have been there a few times, and I think we finished our trip in Hanoi, uh, last time, and we just had like an evening with no plans. So we did like a, uh, a motorcycle food tour and i’m like a motorcyclist like i used to be like a motorcycle instructor i’m pretty competent on two wheels so i show up for this tour and i hadn’t really thought it through it’s like these two girls and like the idea is we get on the back of the bike with them and they take us around like food markets and I’m like, I haven’t paid you yet.
Like, if we’re doing this, I’m riding. Katrina’s coming on the back with me. Like, I don’t trust you guys. And then, you know, you can go two up and you can tell us where to go. So they agreed because that was why they lost my business. We did the food tour, like, holy F. Like, obviously the traffic is chaotic out there.
I knew that. These bikes have like zero brakes. So like I said, like no wonder they didn’t want me to ride the damn things. They are like, they were so rickety. So if you do a food tour, like, you know, make sure your, uh, your driver is competent
[00:55:38] Krzysztof: And wear a helmet.
[00:55:39] Luke: and wear a helmet,
[00:55:40] Krzysztof: All right, this has been another episode of Wall Street Wildlife where we’re trying to, what, make you into a beast of an investor? Is that our tagline?
[00:55:51] Luke: Something like that. That’ll do. Until next week.
